Your Thoughts on the Midnight Diner

[mike duran]

I'm new to the group, but still unsure how "edgy" Christian lit can really get. Anyway, I was an editor for the latest issue of Coach's Midnight Diner: The Back from the Dead Edition, as well as a contributing author. The Midnight Diner is the brainchild of Ben Culbertson, who also foots the bill for Relief Journal. The Diner features, "Hardboiled Horror, Crime, and Paranormal Fiction from a Christian slant." I personally think it fills the gap between the typical G / PG-rated CBA stuff and its more gritty secular counterpart. There is some language, gore, and many of the stories are not explicitly Christian. But I'm interested in the thoughts of other edgy authors.

So I'm wondering, how many of you are familiar with the Diner, have purchased a copy of either issue, or submitted a story. What's your opinion of the Diner concept and the quality of the stories? Do you think there is a market for mags like the Midnight Diner, or that the paranormal / horror genre and language are antithetical to what Christian publishing should stand for? Your thoughts...

[Kat Heckenbach]

I haven't bought/read a copy of the Diner, but I'm very interested in it. I've got it on my wish list (I have to budget my book-buying or we'd go broke). I've only recently discovered it, as I've been writing for less than two years. I write YA fantasy (completed one novel, working on number two), but some of my short stories have taken a rather dark turn. So, I've begun looking into sites and mags that support Christian horror. Not a very long list, is it?

I absolutely believe we need this genre. The struggle between good and evil is dark, scary, paranormal. We don't need to have every bit of Christian writing be dark and scary, but there IS a place for it. I've had to turn to secular magazines, though, to get some of my stuff in print. I have a story coming out in August in The Absent Willow Review that actually has a Christian message, although some Christians would have a nice little fit if I told them so.

I'm going to have to get that copy of the Diner soon, eh? I'd love to submit something, but I haven't gotten to see how edgy the work is.

[Michelle Sutton]

I haven't heard of this so I have nothing to add at the moment. As far as what Christian publishing should stand for? As long as it's redemptive and points to Christ I don't think it matters, though the language (if tacky enough) can distract from the message. There is certainly plenty of gore in many Christian novels now, so that's not a new thing.

[Kat Heckenbach]

The key word in your reply, Michelle, is "novels." There are some pretty gorey Christian novels, although most of them I would label as thrillers--even paranormal/supernatural thrillers--with the exception of a few books out there, like House that can really be called "horror."

But there is no place to market short stories that are Christian in nature but have horror elements. I know of one on-line magazine that takes true Christian horror stories ("Fear and Trembling")--the rest are sci-fi/fantasy, and there are only a handful of those. Other than "Coach's Midnight Diner," I don't think there is a single print mag, and it really qualifies more as an anthology from what I see, so it's not something that is continuously open for submissions. (Correct me if I'm wrong in that, Mike.)

The problem with not having magazines like this is that there are a lot of Christian writers out there who like dark fiction and need a place to get short stories published. If there are no Christian venues, then we have to turn to secular ones. Which means masking our message. Now, technically, I had originally masked my message in the story that will appear in The Absent Willow Review because I intended to shop it in the secular market. But I have another short story I"m having to completely rewrite because it's Christian message is blatant, and since Fear and Trembling didn't accept it, I have no other place to try it as-is.

I do enjoy writing symbolically and allegorically, so writing for the secular market is ok with me, but sometimes I want to write a story that's a bit scary, or really "out there" and have it just scream "Jesus"--but where to submit it? The Christian market is just as subjective as the secular market. A rejection doesn't always mean a story is no good, or even needs work. So, when there are lots of choices, you can take those first few rejections and keep going. But with only one or two choices, you either have to leave the realm, or keep trying to rewrite to please a particular editor.

[Michelle Sutton]

Great answer, Kat. You obviously know more about this subject than I do. :)

[mike duran]

Thanks for your reply, Kat. I attended a workshop at a Christian writers conference a while back that was led by an acquisitions editor for a major Christian publishing house. His topic was: The Future of Christian Fiction. Among other things, he noted that the CBA genre of Supernatural Suspense is really "Christian Horror." Of course, the term "horror" is anathema in CBA circles. But it was refreshing / surprising hearing this come from an industry insider, not so much in affirming the genre but acknowledging the distinction is purely semantical. Many of the CBA books we label as "supernatural suspense" fall easily into the category of horror -- Frank Peretti's "The Oath," Melanie Well's "When the Day of Evil Comes," Eric Wilson's "Undead Trilogy," Dekker's "House" and "Three," Tony Hines' "noir bizarre," Kathy Mackel's "Christian chillers," and the list goes on. In fact, if you haven't read my post "Is Christian Horror Becoming a Trend?" you might want to check it out. Either way, I would contend that "horror" is a viable genre for Christian writers.

But you're right -- there's not a lot of outlets for short "horror' stories with an explicitly Christian angle. The Midnight Diner is an anthology and not continually open for submissions. In many ways, the mag is still trying to get traction in the market. But as editors, we immediately disregard stories that are preachy and tend to pass on those that seem agenda-driven. What I've found is that many secular mags will publish horror stories with spiritual / supernatural themes. (In fact, the same editor I mentioned above suggested that Dean Koontz is now writing more overtly “spiritual” themes than is Ted Dekker.) The key is avoiding the cliches and predictability inherent in so much Christian Fiction. If you want to write horror with an explicitly Christian message, your options are limited. If, however, you don't mind more nuance, subtlety and inference, the runway is wide open.

[Kat Heckenbach]

I'll have to check out your post. I've read quite a few of the books you mentioned. I'm a big Peretti fan, and I loved Dekker's Three.

I agree that stories shouldn't be preachy. The comments I got on the story F&T turned down didn't have anything to do with preachiness. And I did agree with what they said, which is why I'm rewriting. Although, now it's gotten way too long for F&T, so I'm shifting to a more subtle approach and am going to try the secular market, rather than resubmitting. But the story as it was would have been too blatant for the secular market.

I guess it just bugs me that books and movies can have blatantly anti-Christian messages, like The Golden Compass series, where the "protagonists" can decide to kill God, named specifically as God--but if you have a story in which the power of Jesus is called in, it gets a label slapped on it.

Ok, no ranting :). I need to just go ahead and buy the latest issue of The Diner and see exactly what you mean by their guidelines of subtlety, whether it blows my book budget or not :).

[Kat Heckenbach]

OK, me again. I read your post about Christian horror. Very good. And it brought up what I hadn't articulated so far, but totally agree with you on. There is a HUGE difference between psychological horror and slash-fests. I HATE movies and books full of pointless gore. Freddy, Jason, all that--a complete waste of time. And the images they invoke give me nightmares, to be quite honest.

But creepy and disturbing, Like you said, the Sixth Sense, etc. Books that mess with your head and make you think. It's a totally different experience.

[Kat Heckenbach]

OK, bought the Diner--should say, ordered it. I'll read it when it gets here and tell ya what I think.

Looking forward to it!

[Michelle Sutton]

I'd say Eric Wilson's Undead books are horror as is Ted Dekker's Boneman's Daughters.

[Kat Heckenbach]

Looked up Eric Wilson's books. The Undead series looks really good. Man, this is messing up my budget big-time. And my book shelf is screaming as it is.

Oh, well :).

[Charles Funderburg]

I'm still trying to figure out what "Christian Horror" really means.

Is it blood and gore?
Is it demons and ghosts?
Is it scary and dark (and brooding?)
And at the risk of seeming obtuse, how exactly do you 'scream "Jesus"' in a horror story?

I mean, I know Paul was beheaded, and Christians were fed to the lions, and Jesus dealt with demons. But somehow, the Bible makes it seem rather matter of fact. Now Ahab and Jezebel were pretty scary, but not quite horror -- okay, maybe. Jezzy gets thrown out a window and eaten by dogs after she splats. Gorey, gristley, but horror?

I'm stumped.

[Kat Heckenbach]

OK, I'll use a story I wrote as an example. It's not published, but I got some positive feedback on it from Fear and Trembling (I think the exact words were "spooky and atmospheric"). The action revolved around a psycho ex-boyfriend of the main character coming after her. That description alone might put it in the "thriller" category, but the fact that he was no longer in his body--he'd transformed himself into a digital soul and was tormenting her through her computer--pushed it into "horror." The way it "screamed Jesus" is that he was unable to take her soul, which was his goal, because, as the main character says, "My soul doesn't belong to me. I've already given it away." I never included the name Jesus, but she's holding onto a silver cross charm when she speaks the words.

The editors at F&T told me it needed a little more work, that I needed to draw the resolution of the conflict out a bit more, and I agreed with them once I took some time away from it and reread it. Now, I've revised it so much, it's gone from 1400 words to 5200 words and I've had to find another market to submit it! But, I did, and am awaiting the response right now (none too patiently, I might add.)

Anyway, visit www.fearandtremblingmag.com to see examples Christian horrror short stories. And scroll back through here--Mike Duran has some links to different postings of his that cover the subject well.

And, of course, you can buy a copy of Coach's Midnight Diner :).